Wednesday, March 2, 2011

Paul Ryan Hits Romney on Health Care


This one has to sting a little. Recent critiques of RomneyCare have been written off by Mitt's supporters, since most have come from potential primary opponents. Last time I checked, Paul Ryan isn't running for president. Or is he?
...“It’s not that dissimilar to Obamacare," Ryan said when asked about Romney's plan at a breakfast sponsored by the Spectator and held at the offices of Americans for Tax Reform. "And you probably know that I’m not a big fan of ObamaCare."

He went on to critcize a central element of both plans -- the requirement that individuals purchase health insurance.

"I just don’t think the mandates work," Ryan said. "I haven’t studied in depth the status of it, but I think it’s beginning to death spiral, they’re beginning to have to look at rationing decisions. I don’t think this kind of a system works."...

... "That's why I’m a believer in a consumer-based patient centered health care reforms, and I don’t think that the Massachusetts plan does it, it goes in the opposite direction.”...
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42 comments:

ellie said...

Well, if he sat down and READ the darn thing, instead of taking talking points from huckles the clown, he might understand that MassCare, that romney signed - not what is in place today - was just for the good folks of Mass.

Noelle said...

I have nothing against Paul Ryan, but he said something dumb here.

"I haven’t studied in depth the status of it, but I think it’s beginning to death spiral, they’re beginning to have to look at rationing decisions. I don’t think this kind of a system works."

Maybe you should study in depth the status of it. Then what you think will carry more weight.

Noelle said...

I'm tired of the superficial analysis of politicians on both sides of the aisle who spout talking points and lack any depth of thinking.

Anonymous said...

I think one of two things are happening here. Actually it's probably both.

1. Republicans realize that MassCare = Romney losing a general election against Obama. The hard work that has been put into fighting that horrific legislation will be knee-capped with a Romney nomination.

2. Ryan understands that MassCare not only opened the door to Democrat revisions but also led to ObamaCare. A popular theory is that Obama has not once been out of campaign mode since he took the oath of office and he saw the ObamaCare/MassCare connection as a way to get a liberal program shoved down our throats, while at the same time taking an argument away from one of his possible competitors.

With Ryan's roadmap, not too many people can accuse him of playing politics...he fights for the unpopular choices time and time again. There really is no reason for him to ridicule Romney just for the sake of it.

This could be the most damning statement against MassCare that we have heard and I wonder how much of an impact it will have with the Washington insiders and big campaign money that is just waiting to be donated?

Romey better rethink that apology and fast.

jerseyrepublican

Anonymous said...

Romney should have been responsible enough to understand what that legislation would be turned into when he handed the reigns over to a Democrat Governor. The fact that he didn't forward think the ramifications of MassCare is cause for concern.

jerseyrepublican

OhioJOE said...

GOD Bless Mr. Ryan and Mr. Huckabee from saving us from Socialism. NOW IS THE TIME TO FIGHT! What people forgot is that Canada and Europe did not become Socialistic over-night. It is a long process and we must stop this madness right away.

OhioJOE said...

"Romney should have been responsible enough to understand what that legislation would be turned into when he handed the reigns over to a Democrat Governor." BINGO, That Romneyite guy from MO used to crack me when he suggested that Socialistic policies were not bad per se as long as they were managed by the right people. Even if this is true and even if we concede Mr. Romney is a good manager (which is at best questionable) Mr. Romney is not going to be Governor or President for ever. A small detail that people forget.

BOSMAN said...

"I haven’t studied in depth the status of it, but I think it’s beginning to death spiral, they’re beginning to have to look at rationing decisions. I don’t think this kind of a system works."

That has to be the dumbest statement I've heard all week!

DanL said...

Jersey, I have said many times that it would be a big mistake for Romney to apologize. He may well be in an untenable position here, damned if he does, damned if he doesn't. Without a doubt he would be damned by Huck and company if he did apologize...just one more flip flop, and the biggest one yet. It remains to be seen if he will be damned in the primary if he doesn't apologize. I have expressed to friends that I wish that he would simply not run in 2012, that he would just enjoy retirement. And in not running, I would hope that he would quietly get his backers behind another, better candidate, like Daniels.

Right Wingnut said...

Could it be that many Republicans don't want to spend most of 2012 defending Mitt's health care plan? One would think that would make the case for repeal more difficult.

Anonymous said...

JR and OJ. This is so easy.

(PALIN) should have been responsible enough to understand what that legislation (ACES)would (do to business in Alaska) The fact that (she) didn't forward think the ramifications of (ACES) is cause for concern.

Now Parnell is cleaning up the mess.

-Martha

BOSMAN said...

RWN,

"Could it be that many Republicans don't want to spend most of 2012 defending Mitt's health care plan?"

Only the ones who don't support Romney!

Anonymous said...

I like Ryan, and I don't know how much he has really studied MassCare. It doesn't sound like a whole lot.

Maybe he is right. But I think we sorely need an in-depth, objective analysis of the similarities and differences between OCare and MCare so that we can have an honest debate.

-Martha

Anonymous said...

Bosman, you live there, so you know more than almost all of us about the practical application of MassCare. Do you think it is similar to ObamaCare?

BTW - What happened to that other guy who used to post on ROS, who was also from Mass and a very articulate defender of MassCare. I remember he said that he was out of work, and therefore had some time to comment. I just can't remember his name. We need him around here, too.

-Martha

Anonymous said...

Dan, I am not suggesting that he should apologize for implementing a program that he had every right to do...what I am suggesting is that he states that if MassCare inspired ObamaCare, then I wish we never proceeded with the program. It's acknowledging a campaign truth while admitting nothing, nor taking any blame for the program.

jerseyrepublican

Anonymous said...

Also Dan, Daniels cannot beat Obama...not going to happen. You have to remember...what's appealing to political junkies and policy junkies and what's appealing to the average American voter are two different things...I do not think the average voter will elect Daniels.

jerseyrepublican

Anonymous said...

Martha, are you actually attempting to compare the ramifications of MassCare to the ramifications of ACES? Hahahahahaha...I needed a good laugh. ACES is hurting the oil industry in Alaska? Hahahaha, one of the only industries that have benefitted during the recession is being hurt by ACES....HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!

jerseyrepublican

Anonymous said...

Jersey, why should Romney say he wishes they never proceeded with the program, when it's entirely untrue? Romney should not apologize for it, he's proud of it, and should be. More people are alive, more people are taking responsibility for their own health care.

Romney will weather the storm because he has the facts on his side, I believe.

-Martha

DanL said...

Jersey, at this point I am firmly convinced that no one will beat Obama in 2012. Not unless he makes some major mistake in the next 12 months. There was a lot of furor over Obamacare, but that fire burned itself out in the 2010 elections. At least for most people. You and I may still be mad as heck about it, but the average voter in the average purplish state will not still on fire over it by 2012. So I don't really care who is the nominee at this point, as long as it isn't Huck. Well, truth to tell, I would be pretty upset about Huntsman or Johnson as well, but Huck would be my worst nightmare. I prefer Daniels to Romney because I believe Daniels will tell it like it is and not just pander to the voters the way Romney will.

Anonymous said...

Martha, I believe you're referring to SED...or SETH? Anyway, the problme isn't about the intricate similarities or differences between the two...it's in the summary of the two. Even Obama has accepted possible options to amend the health care ill...I believe 2 or 3 of his suggestions are more ideas from MassCare.

jerseyrepublican

Anonymous said...

Martha, if he doesn't...he will lose the nomination...simple as that. If somehow he manages to get the nomination...he will lose the general.

jerseyrepublican

Anonymous said...

Mitt Romney needs to clarify his stance on his Massachusetts health care program on the first day he announces that he is running for President. I am slightly leaning towards the Romney camp right now, but he cannot ignore or demagogue his health care plan. He needs to clarify how the Massachusetts health care plan changed from when he was governor until now.
If he demagogues this issue I will cringe.

Anonymous said...

Also, Jersey--

Palin's rhetoric right now is all about not taxing business. Do you agree?

Yet, that's exactly what she did with ACES. Primarily so she could win popularity. I doubt she seriously considered the consequences.

The oil company said at the beginning that it would dampen their ability to explore and develop oil in Alaska.

Apparently, this has turned out to be true, because the governor and large majority of the legislature want to overturn the law. It hurts business, which ends up hurting the citizens of Alaska.

I guess you think it's okay to pick on the oil companies simply because it was Palin's legislation?

-Martha

Anonymous said...

Demagogue???

It's not Romney that is doin the demagoguing here. Ha ha.

Anonymous said...

Jersey, if Romney apologizes, or makes any excuses for MassCare, he's dead. That's why you and others want him to do it.

He won't, and can't. I agree with Dan that the issue will not be burning in 2012. The only people who are really talking about it are his opponents. In the general, I believe it gives him a great advantage over Obama.

I also agree with Dan that it's going to be darn near impossible to beat Obama. The economy will be the key. I don't think Obama's ineptness is going to factor at all.

-Martha

DanL said...

RW, even though I like Romney, I have to say that cartoon is funny.

Anonymous said...

Martha, have you heard me once mention Palin in this thread...until you mentioned ACES? I actually look at every incident and discussion separate from who I support for the Presidency. Don't you understand that every other possible nominee can rebut ObamaCare based on they WOULD do, endless possiblilities, except for Romney, the basis of the narrative will not be about what he would do...even if he does have a plan...it's about what he DID do. I'm sorry that that's the reality of the situation. A, round-about, apology, I believe, might be endearing to the electorate...the public can forgive mistakes...they cannot forgive unapologetic, bad policy that lead to the creation of ObamaCare.

jerseyrepublican

jerseyrepublican

DanL said...

Jersey, do you remember all those reporters during the height of the Iraq war asking Bush if he had made a mistake? They were just hoping that he would say yes so that they could, like a school of piranha, devour him. If Romney apologizes he seals his political coffin.

Anonymous said...

Also, Martha--

Yes, I agree that Palin does not believe in taxing businesses.

ACES is no more of a tax than Romney raising the prices of fees and closing tax loopholes...probably loopholes that he took advantage of while at Bain...is a tax. ACES is a profit sharing program based upon the Alaskan Constitution, she didn't write the Alaskan Constitution. The program received bi-partisan support based on the fact that the Alaskan Constitution states that the oil is the property of the citizens of the state...just because the oil companies lease the land...does not give them sole ownership to what sits below it.

The oil companies weren't exploring and developing half the land that they leased in Alaska, prior to ACES and it wasn't due to financial constraints.

Again, the oil companies post bigger profits every single quarter...ACES barely puts a scratch on their bottom line. Why Parnell and a minority of the Alaskan legislature wants to overturn it now is beyond me...my guess is that the lobbyists got to the legislators.

We are a nation of laws and Alaska has a Constitution that outlines theirs. Do I have pity for the oil companies because they have to share a minute portion of their multi, multi billion dollar profits with the citizens who actually own the oil....NO.

But let's play your game for a minute...which legislation will hurt the candidate worse...a healthcare bill that has been stated was the inspiration for ObamaCare that also mandates people purchase health insurance or pay a fine...or legislation that upheld the state constitution that gave the citizens their fair share of the natural resource they own? I wonder which legislation will hurt the candidate who enacted it more?

jerseyrepublican

Anonymous said...

Dan, I understand your point but what I am proposing Romney does is apologizing, not for his program, but apologizing if it was bastardized to a point where it became the basis of a national health care bill that it was not intended to be. The apology will grant him major press and an opportunity to truly explain the differences between the two bills with a lot of exposure. Perhaps he is planning to do that and perhaps he is waiting for the heat of the primaries to begin. I know you think it will put his political aspirations in the coffin but right now he is on the defense...he is constantly being reactive instead of proactive...he needs to be proactive.

jerseyrepublican

ConMan said...

So according to Ryan,

MA shouldn't have the right to choose their own path in health care initiatives?

He doesn't like it. Now where does he live?

Anonymous said...

I agree with Noelle. I like Paul Ryan, but he is openly admitting that he hasn't really looked into the matter closely. Stupid comment from Paul Ryan. He obviously used the momentum gained from the healthcare idea to facilitate his conclusions elsewhere. It really wasn't a great statement about MA Care because he admitted that he isn't very informed about it!

AZ

Anonymous said...

ConMan, why do you keep repeating the same illogical statement?

ObamaCare was inspired by MassCare!!! President Obama has made that quite clear.

Where Ryan lives is irrelevant when the creator of MassCare wants to represent the Republican Party, as the Presidential nominee, to defeat President Obama in 2012.

jerseyrepublican

Anonymous said...

JR, why are you so anxious to believe President Obama? If he said the same thing about Palin, you would definitely consider the source. Somehow, Obama trying to take out a potential rival blames Romney for his own personal federal health care plan and suddenly many Republicans/conservatives believe him! This is not intelligent.

Try and find out what is truth and what is a lie about the health care plans, but do not believe Obama on something you would NEVER believe if it was said regarding your favorite candidate.

AZ

CraigS said...

Hi All
I continue to try and point out that healthcare in America is like our highway infrastructure and educational system.......falling apart. If anybody, including Paul Ryan, have an idea how to improve it....why hasn't it been improved ? What has Ryan or barbour or Huckabee or any of the myriad other critics done to improve it ? All they do is whine and complain about what they don't like. And states like Mississippi and Arkansas fight it out for dead last in healthcare. And then, they take pride in not improving the status quo....which flat out stinks.
So do something positive or get off the bus. America hasn't got the time to hear what's wrong. We need leaders who actually try to fix things
CraigS

Anonymous said...

AZ, I don't know if it was inspired by MassCare but the point is it doesn't matter...it is being sold that way and the media and Obama are the salesman and the average voter is the buyer. I think they will end up buying it. 28% of the people polled believed Palin was responsible for the Tuscon shootings, even though the facts show otherwise. Do you think that the media will go easy on Romney? I merely suggested that Romney needs to be proactie if he wants to weather the storm. Just wishing and saying over and over agian..."nah uh," will change the reality of the situation.

jerseyrepublican

DanL said...

CraigS, I highly value each and every one of your comments where you cite statistics about US health care. Not because I love Romney, but because you are stating such important statistics that everyone else just wants to ignore. What is it, 16%? of our GDP going to health care? Republicans can't just keep running away from this. And going to a 100% unregulated free market sure as heck isn't going to solve this problem.

Anonymous said...

RW - I agree--that cartoon is funny.

-Martha

Noelle said...

The cartoon is funny, but it would be more accurate if Obama's kid was obese and Romney's kid was scrawny.

Anonymous said...

For the life of me, I don't see where a Romney vs. Obama general election is a negative.

Obama can have two approaches:

"Obamacare is great, I took the initial structure of it from my opponent." Okay - you're the kid that couldn't solve a problem and stole the smart guy's idea.

"Obamacare has problems, but I took the idea from my opponent." Okay - you're not bright enough to recognize and solve the drawbacks of another person's experiment... "...but it was his idea! boo hoo"

Romney on the other hand has all kinds of ammunition... "Mr. President, let me list your mistakes..." It will be like shooting fish in a barrel.

Anonymous said...

Anon, Obama is proud of ObamaCare but he understands the general public question it. If the Republican nominee's argument is stifled due to MassCare the public will see it as a wash and the fact that Romney is protesting ObamaCare will make him look petty and like a hypocrite.

jerseyrepublican

Anonymous said...

Martha, I'm still waiting for your response to my response about ACES.

jerseyrepublican