Thursday, November 17, 2011

The Hill | Jonathan Gruber: RomneyCare and ObamaCare Are “the Same F—ing Bill”

The architect of both RomneyCare and ObamaCare seeks to set the record straight on Romney's claims of "significant differences" between the signature accomplishments of President Obama and Governor Romney.
White House hopeful Mitt Romney is “lying” when he says the healthcare law he signed in Massachusetts is substantively different from President Obama’s, a key architect of both plans said Wednesday.

Jonathan Gruber, a healthcare economist and a professor at Massachusetts Institute of Technology, made the comments in an interview with Capital New York, criticizing Romney’s attempt to argue that the federal healthcare law goes further than what he signed as Massachusetts governor.

“The problem is there is no way to say that,” Gruber said. “Because they’re the same f—ing bill. He just can’t have his cake and eat it too. Basically, you know, it’s the same bill. He can try to draw distinctions and stuff, but he’s just lying. The only big difference is he didn’t have to pay for his. Because the federal government paid for it. Where at the federal level, we have to pay for it, so we have to raise taxes.”

Gruber helped craft Romney’s healthcare bill and also consulted with the Obama administration during the healthcare debate.
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47 comments:

BOSMAN said...

Hahahaha!

One's FEDERAL.....One is state. One raised taxes, one did not. One has THE SUPPORT of the people, one did not.
I have writen several pieces on this as a MA resident. I won't get into that here.

I found it interesting that the very first comments on the article at the hill, seem to UNDERSTAND. RW, maybe you should read the comments there rather than the article:

And I am one of those healthy people who won't purchase health insurance as it is MY right NOT to. As far as Romneycare is concerned, from what I gather, it is the same, but Romney is arguing that one is good for the State is not constitutional for the FEDS as they over reach their authority. I AGREE with this assessment and have written not only my senators, but the Supreme Court as well, way back in 2010. I am very, very angry that the govt. thinks it can extort money from me. I already told the Justices, someone will have to put me in jail because I am NOT releasing anything to the IRS and if I have to, I will conceal my worth, yep for the first time in over 50 years, I will cheat. Hate to do it, but the govt. will leave me no choice if this mandate is ruled anyway but UNCONSTITUTIONA L.

BY josie on 11/16/2011 at 16:30

Here is the big difference. STATES RIGHTS. States have far more rights to regulate these things as opposed to the federal government. That is the beauty of our nation of states. Different states can try different programs and if they work, other states can feel free to implement those programs. There is no one-size-fits-all for states in most instances. The people in MA may have wanted the system they got, doesn't mean the people in TN should be forced to do the same. We are a nation of states people, keep the power local instead of handing it to a centralized government trying to enforce policies that in the end sell everyone short.

BY Red on 11/16/2011 at 16:37

This statement kind of makes me wonder what kind of compromising pictures Mr. Gruber is starring in…If Obocare was the same as Romneycare then it would have caused 98% to be covered with private insurance, rather than Obocare's dismal 75% coverage of sometimes minimum coverage…Why didn't Mr. Gruber address the fact that Romney vetoed much of the pork added to Romneycare by the corrupt progressive dems on Beacon Hill, only to have most of them over-ridden by that communist based faction? Again Mr. Gruber, what kind of pictures were you threatened with? And how pathetic has your life become?

BY StPete on 11/16/2011 at 16:47

Anonymous said...

How can they be the same f---ing bill if 'Romneycare' is 70 pages long and the other is over 1,000 pages long? Moron.

leighrow said...

RW

Obamacare and Romneycare are not the same bill. This guy is a paid operative of the Obama campaign and will do and say anything to make sure Obamacare stays in tact.

I would pay money to see Romney debate Obama on the differences of these two bills and to discuss why this solution will not work on a national level.

Attached is a link highlighting the differences of the two bills if you even care to look at it and become informed on the facts.

http://americaneedsmitt.com/blog/obamacare-romneycare-truth/

Besides,this whole discussion is a mute point, because Romney will immediately give states waivers so they do not have to factor in the costs of Obamacare and he will repeal Obamacare ASAP!

You must be one of those people who would vote for Adolf Hitler over a Morman.

Noelle said...

78 pages vs. 2700 pages. Not the same thing.

State plan vs. federal plan. Not the same thing.

Done AFTER balancing the budget vs. not bothering about balancing the budget. Not the same thing.

Compliant with the MA Constitution vs. (arguably) not compliant with the US Constitution. Not the same thing.

Affect 8% of the population of MA vs. affects 100% of the population of the US. Not the same thing.

Overwhelming bipartisan support vs. bipartisan rejection. Not the same thing.

I guess Mr. Gruber fails to understand the meaning of the word "same."

Anonymous said...

Obamacare is like going into work one day and finding out your company is now owned by the government. Or if your an athleate and go to your gym for a workout, you find out you're now government owned and state sponsored athleate, like in some communist countries. Obamacare is a takeover into a part of your life.

Romneycare is no such thing. It's healthcare coverage meant for the 8% of Mass uninsured,--with private health insurance. It did not take over into a part of lives of Mass residents as Obmacare would.

Many may not like Romneycare, but it is the most conservative health legislation that could've been passed in Mass.

Right Wingnut said...

Ahhhhhhh....

Leighrow plays the Mormon card on me. It was only a matter of time. He/she has been proven to be a hack both here and at The Right Scoop. You just lost all credibility with your shark jump.

Anonymous said...

I'm glad this discussion has been going on for months/years now. RomneyCare really isn't an issue for Mitt anymore, because we've been there done that for so long now that people understand the difference. It's so obvious.

So RW, I'm not sure these posts do any good for your cause. This is rehashing yesterday's news.

-Martha

Noelle said...

Follow up on Martha's comment. What is your cause anymore RW?

Anonymous said...

who cares?? This guy is just desperate? Who hasnt heard of romneycare? There are big differences. Romney=care was designed to insure only the 8% uninsured in MA, you know those freeloaders? Obama=care wants to control the entire HC system even for those that currently have HC coverage.

Anonymous said...

Leave my Uncle RW alone!!!

Ohio JOE said...

"Leighrow plays the Mormon card on me." Of course, that is what one can do when they are not winning the arguement on policy.

mark said...

Hey, the guy dropped the f-bomb. He must know what he's talking about.

Anonymous said...

If they were so similar why did MA elect a Republican senator to help stop ObamaCare. If they were so similar why would MA even care?

OH! I know! Because they are not similar at all!

The only thing they share is the mandate. But God forbid you populist actually read both bills.

leighrow said...

RW
My feelings towards you are quite mutual.We will just have to agree to disagree.

Toodles,

Leighrow

Anonymous said...

RW,

Look at the Rombots lash out....you really got under their skin. This is just a taste of what Romney is going to get if/when he is the GOP nominee. Before the Left & the Mainstream Media is done, ObamaCare & RomneyCare will be the exact same thing.

As for leighrow...you are so pathetic and lame. Your fellow Rombot buddies won't call you out but I will. Who do think you are calling RW a Mormon hating bigot? You don't know him at all. I have been on this site for nearly a year and RW has never said anything about Romney & his religion. How long have you been here junior....a month? Quit being such a thin skinned little baby. Just because someone doesn't approve of your hero doesn't make them a bigot. You should be ashamed of yourself...and before you have another wittle temper tantrum & call me a bigot too, I am supporting Romney. I'm just not a drooling Rombot droid like you.

A.J.R.

Anonymous said...

I should have said....By the time that the Left & the Mainstream Media are done, ObamaCare & RomneyCare will be the exact same thing.

A.J.R.

Ohio JOE said...

Well said A.J.R. I am a little sad that you are an honorary Romneyite, but I understand you gotta do what you gotta do. The field is what it is.

Anonymous said...

AJR,

I have to say that I have no reason to think RW is a bigot. Maybe a lot of other things, but I digress . . .

I think the ObamaCare is RomneyCare meme has just about worn itself out. I really don't think Obama can use it effectively against Romney. But we'll see.

I'm glad you are supporting Romney. I appreciate the fact that in spite of the way I and others treated Palin, you have to good sense to see that Romney is about the only choice left.

-Martha

Anonymous said...

OJ,

I'm no Romneyite or Rombot....I just think he's the best of this bunch. I'm just not going to act like he is perfect. He has flaws...and ignoring them aren't going to make them go away.

A.J.R.

Ohio JOE said...

I am sorry AJR, I did not mean to insult you. A Romneyite and a Rombot are not exactly the same thing, but it still was a bad choice of words on my part. I apoligize.

Anonymous said...

OJ,

Nothing to apologize about....not insulted in the least. Just wanted to let you know that I am neither of those things. Just regular old AJR.

OJ...if you had to pick a candidate to support, who would it be? Santorum, Paul or none of them? Just curious who you may be leaning to. Hope all is well with you.

A.J.R.

Right Wingnut said...

The only Mormon related comments I've made have to do with some of Romney's Mormon supporters. I loathe religion baiting as much as Herman Cain's race baiting. In addition, I've stated that some Mormons support Mitt primary because he's a Mormon. I stand by that. To be fair, some are supporting Cain because he's black, or Bachmann because she's a woman, or Santorum because he's Catholic, or Perry because he's Evangelical. There isn't necessarily anything wring with it, but some aren't willing to admit that those are factors.

I suppose the fact that I voted for Mitt in '08 doesn't count?

Terrye said...

Nonsense...for a million different reasons. The hypocrites railing against Romneycare did not squat at the time it was actually passed anyway.

Terrye said...

It is funny to see Ohio Joe and RightWingNut and AJR talk about Rombots lashing out etc..when they themselves are using Democratic talking points to try and damage the candidate most likely to win the nomination...it is almost as if they want Obama to win a second term..if they are going to be such purists maybe they should come up with a better candidate rather than just trashing Romney with the same sad and silly propaganda.

Anonymous said...

RW, I agree with you that some people tend to favor those like them, but the oft-repeated accusation around the blogs is that Romney's support is mostly from Mormons and they are only voting for him because of his faith. I just don't think that is the case.

-Martha

Anonymous said...

LOL. Gruber's basically arguing that a Great Dane and a Beagle are the same because they are both dogs... oh, and "f-ing" = he really, really means it.

Ohio JOE said...

"The hypocrites railing against Romneycare did not squat at the time it was actually passed anyway." Yeah, like I really had any power to stop MAcare. I did my part in my own state.

"if they are going to be such purists maybe they should come up with a better candidate rather than just trashing Romney with the same sad and silly propaganda." And if we did you trash them too like you do every other non-Romney candidate.

Anonymous said...

Terrye,

If you would have bothered to read my comments rather than "lash out" because you and other Rombots are so thin skinned about anyone saying anything negative about your hero...you would have seen that I am supporting Romney. My support isn't nearly as strong as your Rombot programming so I can actually see that Romney isn't perfection personified. Just warning you what the media is going to say but you just stay in your little Rombot bubble and believe that Romney is perfect.

A.J.R.

Ohio JOE said...

Well AJR, on Super Dupper Tuesday, I will only get the chance to vote for primary candidates for Senate, state House, Country Commissioner and other county officers. By the time we vote for Congressman and President, Mr. Santorum and Mrs. Bachmann will be out. So yes, I imagine I will be struck voting for Dr. Paul. Oh and on a side note, I am pretty much finished with the idea of possibly voting for Mr. Cain. When he was interviewed in Milwaukee, he illustrated that he was more ignorant about my state than Mr. Romney. At least Mrs. Palin did her homework when he came to Ohio.

leighrow said...

RW,

I apologize if you were offended by my post. I am in the healthcare sector so this issue is one of my HOT BUTTONS. If Obama gets 4more years the average middle class american will be screwed big time. I predict there will be no more middle class. I am in strong agreement with Coulter that Romney is the best GOP candidate to compete with Obama and win. Several polls are showing that.

If Romney does not get the GOP nomination, I would still vote for the GOP nominee, even if it is Ron Paul.

Bottom line there is no perfect GOP candidate,so that is why I feel that electibility has to be the key factor.

regards

Ohio JOE said...

You see AJR, there is no room in their camp for you. Unless you believe in pure Romneyism, you are not good enough. That is why I'll never join their camp even if I end up voting for him.

Right Wingnut said...

OJ,

That isn't the only thing Cain is ignorant of. Yesterday, he met with Cuban conservatives in Florida, but wasn't prepared to answer questions about policies relating to Cuba....calling them "gotcha questions." how do you not prepare yourself for this, Herman?

Ohio JOE said...

"If Obama gets 4more years the average middle class american will be screwed big time. I predict there will be no more middle class." That train is already leaving the station.

Right Wingnut said...

Leighrow, apology accepted.

Machtyn said...

RWN: I suspect there are a number of Mormons voting for Romney because he is also LDS. (I then ask those same people about Huntsman, hehe.)

I also suspect there are a number of Mormons specifically NOT voting for Romney because they don't want to appear voting for a Mormon for religion-sake.

Also, speaking of Cain, I wonder if he learned how to "say 'delicious' in Cuban". (As FoxNews answered it, "you say it in Spanish," hehe.)

Right Wingnut said...

deliciosa, el señor Caín

leighrow said...

Ohio Joe,

I fear you are correct and we desperately need someone to slam on the brakes and back it up.

Graham said...

With regard to Gruber's profanity-enhanced declaration:

A gun is a gun is a gun, sure. If you give a Glock 9 to a cop and one to a criminal, it's the same gun.

Technically.

At least until they start firing. Then the gun becomes something else based on what it does.

They're not the same.

Terrye said...

AJR:

I did read your comment. I did not just lash out..but you did.

Terrye said...

Ohio Joe...I do not think it is a matter of pure Romneyism...however, considering the sorry excuse for candidates so many of his detractors have managed to come up with...well they just don't need to be lecturing the rest of us..and like I said, it was years ago when Romneycare passed and since then many conservatives supported Romney..they did not get all bent out of shape about it until it suited their purpose to get all bent out of shape..

leighrow said...

Okay it is me again. I think everyone knows that I am a Romney supporter because I strongly feel he is the most electable amongst women,moderates and independents.

Attached is another article regarding Gingrich and I strongly feel that it is very relevant. The facts in the article can be verified so I don't consider it to be baseless propaganda.

I don't wish to offend anyone but if you wish to read it, attached is the link.

http://endoftheamericandream.com/archives/27-reasons-why-newt-gingrich-would-be-a-really-really-bad-president

Regards,
Leighrow

Paul said...

Gruber is an obvious Obama man, and a lying sack of communist manure. No one should think that Romney had anything to do with Gruber going over to the Dark Side to help defile the U.S. Constitution with Obama Care. That is a ploy by leftist revolutionary Democrats, which has unfortunately had some success with the more obtuse and biggoted "Any-Body-but-Romney" crowd. The only thing worse than being a leftist Democrat, is being a tool for leftist Democrats.

Paul said...

Sorry, should be "bigoted."

Slick-Willy said...

Romney is far from perfect, but he is a very good candidate. And, he has become THE measuring stick. The reason candidates have imploded has been because they have failed to live up to expectations. But their expectations have been harsh--look better than Romney--an impossible task for even good candidates. Especially over a long period filled w/annoyingly frequent debates.

Romney is a very good candidate and he'll be a very good president. I'd drop him like a rock if I found someone better, but I have not. And I believe it is because of Romney this field has looked weak. Without him I think several of the candidates would appear much more palatable. Being contrast against Romney everyday cannot be a fun experience.

Anonymous said...

I am not a purist Romney supporter, as OJ knows. Why do you continually bash all Romney supporters as being the same, when we are as diverse as Sarah Palin supporters, many of whom seem to have run to Newt. I know Newt is a smart man, but I think his ego is far too large to be a good President, and he has SO much baggage. Should I accuse all Palin supporters of lacking constitutional principles because some support Newt?

AZ

Ohio JOE said...

Well AZ, you truly do belong to a diverse camp. And yes, I know that you for one are welcoming of people who join your camp, but the fact remains that people like AJR get lectured because they do not support him well enough. We are sick of this crazy talk.

Anonymous said...

By the way, "delicious" in Japanese is "Oishii," Cain San.

AZ